Car question

[kaho]

Took a look at the rules for street class cars already, but just want to make sure with the longer-standing guys here. I have plans to obtain a 2000-05 Celica GTS for autocross. Would there be any issues with running a 00-03 TRD package/04-05 Tsunami edition within H street?

These packages include a body kit (my main question regarding H street compliance) and suede seats but these would be considered options offered by original manufacturer. Similarly, if I have a non factory kitted GTS, would I be ok putting the TRD/Tsunami suede seats in it?

[Midnightsky]

definitely A-mod, get a real car, buy a Mazda

Just kidding lol, sorry I couldn't resist

Not sure how that would work, to me factory kits on lower end economy cars are nothing more than looks and shouldn't affect the aerodynamic properties on said vehicle.  Now usually if there is a specific model/trim that did have special consideration by the SCCA it would be listed.  I think the new special edition BRZ falls into that category but that was more so because of performance items that were adjusted/changed by Subaru from the factory. 

I would try to find one that already has everything on the car from factory and that way there is no debate on if it was added later and if that changes your car classification for autocross.  Personally I think the SCCA needs to ease up on the rules for such things as 90% of the time there is no advantage gained, just added weight which is actually a disadvantage. 

[E6Cueman]

Took a look at the rules for street class cars already, but just want to make sure with the longer-standing guys here. I have plans to obtain a 2000-05 Celica GTS for autocross. Would there be any issues with running a 00-03 TRD package/04-05 Tsunami edition within H street?

These packages include a body kit (my main question regarding H street compliance) and suede seats but these would be considered options offered by original manufacturer. Similarly, if I have a non factory kitted GTS, would I be ok putting the TRD/Tsunami suede seats in it?

I don't believe the GT-S was ever offered with either the TRD or Tsunami package body parts, so unfortunately, fitting them to a GT-S takes you out of Street class... and maybe even straight out of Street Touring.  You might however be able to make an argument that the seat swap falls inside the "comfort and convenience" rule allowances with Street class.

On a side note, I think results a decade ago demonstrated that the GT was actually the faster auto-x car in many cases, with more usable torque and a longer second gear.

[PedalFaster]

I don't have any input on the legality of those kits, but did want to point out that a) the Celica GT-S is classed in GS, not HS, and b) some nutcase from Seattle brought out a GT-S one year claiming it was faster, and the next year the defending national champion swapped his GT for a GT-S and declared his agreement with the nutty Seattleite. 🙂

[Reijo]

I think we are all assuming this is not a JDM, so is it a domestic? 

Also only trunk kits were for a Miata in '07, and the FRS which also kicked the FRS into another class.  And I think a Solstace ... can't remember any others for sure not the Celica.

So any springs etc. in the TRD would not be legal ... as per Stephen's commentary.

R

[E6Cueman]

I don't have any input on the legality of those kits, but did want to point out that a) the Celica GT-S is classed in GS, not HS, and b) some nutcase from Seattle brought out a GT-S one year claiming it was faster, and the next year the defending national champion swapped his GT for a GT-S and declared his agreement with the nutty Seattleite. 🙂

Ha!  Well there.

[kaho]

Thanks for the clear-up guys. I looked into the HS pages and found Celica [FWD] and didn't realize they have separated the newer generation (both trim levels) into the higher class.

On the contrary, an RSX Type S (being an even more aggressive vehicle than the new celica) stayed within HS. I wonder what's the rationale for that...

As for the Tsunami edition, they came with both GT and GT-S trims. No suspension upgrades. Just thinking of one because they are rare and look stunning (Gonna also be my daily not just a track car). It is not a JDM, just that very small numbers were made. (359 according to a quick google search, not that it matters much)

I dragged a couple pics and info online just for more clarification:
http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?t=359009
https://www.celicahobby.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/281595/re-thinking-of-purchasing-a-2005-celica-gts-tsunami-what-to.html





From the looks of it though, it seems like I would fare better in the autoX environment if I have a RSX-S with 0.786 PAX vs a Celica with 0.793.

[Midnightsky]

At the end of the day if your just starting out into autocross I wouldn't worry about class and pax.  Your best bet is to get the car you like the best since you will be the one who has to drive it on the daily.   Modify however you wish and don't worry about class until you have some seat time under your belt and have a good idea of where you stand as a driver. At that time you can start digging deeper into class and PAX to see if its even worth it with a Celia or RSX.  Personally I doubt there is any H-street cars that can beat our top 10 PAX drivers within the club.  Maybe Nick's Fiesta ST?

[E6Cueman]

From the looks of it though, it seems like I would fare better in the autoX environment if I have a RSX-S with 0.786 PAX vs a Celica with 0.793.

Not necessarily.  The RSX has never been a great autox car.  The Celica does a few things better despite not having a K20.  Whether the Celica does them better than the current class kings is another matter, but I think it's worth trying.  If you are a student of driving, and come on the right tire, I think you will find meaningful competition. 

[kaho]

Thanks for clearing that up guys! As usual, when one question gets sorted out, another question always come up...*drum rolls*

Has a Toyota Starlet ever been offered in north America? This car was listed on the Hstreet list not followed by (NOC). I know that JDMs normally get classed hard which means for example a stock JDM celica may not be classed the same as a USDM Celica. (Correct me if I'm wrong) but if they specifically put a JDM only car in the list wouldn't it just stay in that class? Also found a similar circumstance with the Mazda Cosmo, didn't know it was ever offered in NA.

I would like to know where would a JDM Starlet Glanza V be classed to. Thanks.

[JCS]

Thanks for clearing that up guys! As usual, when one question gets sorted out, another question always come up...*drum rolls*

Has a Toyota Starlet ever been offered in north America? This car was listed on the Hstreet list not followed by (NOC). I know that JDMs normally get classed hard which means for example a stock JDM celica may not be classed the same as a USDM Celica. (Correct me if I'm wrong) but if they specifically put a JDM only car in the list wouldn't it just stay in that class? Also found a similar circumstance with the Mazda Cosmo, didn't know it was ever offered in NA.

I would like to know where would a JDM Starlet Glanza V be classed to. Thanks.

Not the type of starlet you're thinking of, but the very early 80's RWD ones did exist in North America at some point.  Go the Celica, it's light, the 2zzge is a great engine and one of the best handling FWD cars ever built.  You'd have a lot of fun in it.  Only modification I'd recommend is tires, and I was on the fence about RE71R's till this weekend, but consider me a convert.

[SKI-R]

You must be serious about wanting a Toyota, Honda, import - otherwise, just go buy Chris's Focus for $1500 and run the crap out of it until you improve as a driver.  You'll spend at least that much modding a daily to get it where you want - 40-50% in tires alone!

[Midnightsky]

You must be serious about wanting a Toyota, Honda, import - otherwise, just go buy Chris's Focus for $1500 and run the crap out of it until you improve as a driver.  You'll spend at least that much modding a daily to get it where you want - 40-50% in tires alone!

^^^^^^^^ This

That Focus is about 5 seconds faster than my 2017 Mazda 3 and I will spend at least $1500 trying to close that 5 second gap.  If I had $1500 and somewhere to store that thing Id have already bought it myself.  If you have the option, take that Focus and you'll learn so much more in seat time than trying to mod something else to go faster.  You will save a ton of money this way and last I checked money doesn't grow on trees, unless your holding out on us

[JCS]

You must be serious about wanting a Toyota, Honda, import - otherwise, just go buy Chris's Focus for $1500 and run the crap out of it until you improve as a driver.  You'll spend at least that much modding a daily to get it where you want - 40-50% in tires alone!

^^^^^^^^ This

That Focus is about 5 seconds faster than my 2017 Mazda 3 and I will spend at least $1500 trying to close that 5 second gap.  If I had $1500 and somewhere to store that thing Id have already bought it myself.  If you have the option, take that Focus and you'll learn so much more in seat time than trying to mod something else to go faster.  You will save a ton of money this way and last I checked money doesn't grow on trees, unless your holding out on us

This is pretty good advice, especially since the focus comes with a set of RE71R.

[zero10]

You must be serious about wanting a Toyota, Honda, import - otherwise, just go buy Chris's Focus for $1500 and run the crap out of it until you improve as a driver.  You'll spend at least that much modding a daily to get it where you want - 40-50% in tires alone!

^^^^^^^^ This

That Focus is about 5 seconds faster than my 2017 Mazda 3 and I will spend at least $1500 trying to close that 5 second gap.  If I had $1500 and somewhere to store that thing Id have already bought it myself.  If you have the option, take that Focus and you'll learn so much more in seat time than trying to mod something else to go faster.  You will save a ton of money this way and last I checked money doesn't grow on trees, unless your holding out on us

This is pretty good advice, especially since the focus comes with a set of RE71R.

As the seller of said focus - thanks for the marketing guys!  That was totally not coerced! (We'lll discuss payment later)

As for the focus, sorry to sort of advertise here, but my intention with selling it was to see it go to somebody who is looking to get into the sport.  The car isn't perfect - honestly, it's pretty ugly, and it needs a couple things, though the longer I sit with the car the more of them I will probably take care of, but it's a great starter car that has the potential to place well.  Even if you leave it in STF (where it currently resides) it often breaks into the top 10 at events with me piloting it, and I know for a fact when Steffan has driven it he can beat me by as much as 0.25-1.0 seconds per run which usually puts him 3-5 spots above me.  The RE-71Rs that are on it have just been flipped and will only be used at one more event (July 8, Westerner Park) before I am done for the year.  I would expect they have between 4 and 10 events left on them depending on how gentle you are on tires, but this set only cost me $561 including mount, balance and GST from Costco last fall so it's not like they are expensive.

Midnightsky - I may have beaten you by 5 seconds but I suspect your Mazda 3 has some more time left in it.  With good tires your car should be able to beat the Focus in RAW and therefore badly beat the Focus in PAX.  Practice practice practice, and then, tires, then practice some more.  I've been at this over 5 years and honestly, I still kinda suck sometimes.

Alright I should stop hijacking this thread, sorry!